I don’t think this is quite accurate. The Habsburgs were pretty much chased out of Austria and their property seized, they were not very popular.
8mm to the Left: If Hitler Died in 1923
- Thread starter KaiserKatze
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Chilling to see Adler refuse the evidence of democratic backsliding, albeit for understandable reasons I can sympathize with on a personal level. If I was Jewish, I wouldn’t trust the Prussian elites as far as I could throw them. The bar is only this low from our perspective since what happened IRL was so much worse.
Ah, but to the people he listens to/hangs around, it's totally false, they love the Hapsburgs!
Reactionary autocrat and a "fascist" whose more "the way it used to be" than revolutionary authoritarianism. They're both idiots. Especially in Austria as neither the old ways or the status quo is any kind of popular option. GrossDeutschland (or if Bavaria had done a bunk in the early 20's union with the southern bits of the German empire as was) is the only acceptable option for most. It's only post WW2 that an Austrian "identity" developed and that was done in a big hurry to get off the hook over the terrifying number of citizens who willingly fought for Hitler. Something which as Waldheim proved simply let them ignore their obligations for 40 years and only got allowed due to the cold war.
Similar to Germany, the fact that a lot of people opposed or disliked the monarchy doesn’t mean that there is a universal opposition to them. They was a definite chunk of the population which held loyalty to their ex-kings in both Austria and Hungary, but the trauma of the war helped the Republican regime crush it. Austrofascism and the Church both leaned heavily into the Habsburgs as being the only true Divinely Appointed monarchs in Europe, and a lot of people bought into it.
But as @Knightmare says, this is also a reflection of Dollfuß’s which is a bit warped. While the Habsburgs have a level of support, it is nowhere near the level which he thinks or hopes it to be. I envisioned him as a bit of a reflection of von Lettow-Vorbeck, but where he is too enchanted by his monarchist dreams and lacks the ability to lay groundwork for it or plan outside of it
Garrison
Donor
Oh good the Italians are planning a war in the Balkans, I'm sure that will be a wild success that will not in any way threaten to draw the wrath of Britain, Germany, Turkey and the USSR. IOTL it was Turkish pressure that kept the Bulgarians out of the Italian campaign in Greece, and only the arrival of a large number of Wehrmacht divisions changed their mind. What worries me is that if things go badly in the Balkans Mussolini might turn to chemical weapons in the absence of a large German army ready to intervene. I can also see a version of the Anschluss happening, though with the Germans invading it.
The prospect here is European war with a very different alignment of interests and allies.
The prospect here is European war with a very different alignment of interests and allies.
I mean, if I were a young, educated Jewish socialist in Germany at this point, seeing how Europe is slowly turning to fascism, suspicious of von Lettow-Vorbeck, I'd be paranoid too.
In truth his concern is fair, but turning to the (basically) Communists also isn't a clever move, since they are just rabble-rousers who promote a complete reshaping of society which would, even if it succeeded, create a lot of instability for a long time. Plus, so far, von Lettow-Vorbeck has proved surprisingly willing to concede "socialist" reforms in the name of stability and support, so there isn't yet much reason to assume that, even if he restores the monarchy, that he would suddenly backpeddle, especially when even the monarchy wasn't that vehemently antisemitic (though it was somewhat)
The Kaiser himself was no worse (just no better) than most European leaders at that time. Certainly miles ahead of say the later Tsars, one of his sons on the other hand (forget which one) went Nazi OTL.
Garrison
Donor
But this is hardly new for the Jews of Europe and its still vastly better than the 19th Century and frankly a revolution is likely to make matters worse not better. The aftermath of such things is rarely marked by democracy and prosperity. The most likely result of a revolution is that the country falls into the hands of extremists, who will need a scapegoat when things go badly and we all know who they would choose. Besides I don't think Europe is turning fascist and if/when the economy improves the appeal of the extremes with decline.
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I don't see how a revolutionary restructuring of German society in the Weimar era is so unreasonable when we can see how things went IOTL and are now seeing how Lettow-Vorbeck is slowly eroding democracy ITTL. The fact that his government is using more of an "iron fist in a velvet glove" strategy than the naked brutality of the Nazis doesn't mean he's not creating issues of his own, to say nothing of other powerful men like Goering siccing the secret police on domestic and foreign opponents. The government is still happily targeting Jewish socialists like the character in question, only they're more likely to do so for the "socialist" part than the "Jewish" part (and are still empowering other far-right elements who have that agenda). As the saying goes, is it "paranoia" if they're really out to get you?
Parts of it still are and Germany is still rather dictator like. Some (especially around Munich) will also remember that it's not so terribly long since a Jew hater was doing annoyingly well and has some support, while he caught a bullet some probably still worry that idea isn't completely out of the German political ecosystem.
Garrison
Donor
Yeah but it wouldn't be a new experience for them and frankly those who remember the last war recognize the lesser evil. I mean even IOTL a great many Jews chose to soldier on in the expectation that things would get better and in the absence of the 'Austrian housepainter' they probably will.
Ooh, things are going very interestingly rn! I love how dolfuss just feels like he's being humiliated by Mussolini, and I feel the rest of his countrymen feel that they've been fucked over by the Italians, and that the Austrian state is nothing but a farce. By the end I'd not be surprised if Austrian nationalism is dead and gone, with all Austrians thinking that any independent Austrian state is destined to be terrible for everyone involved.
I love the portions about the sdp and co too. Even though we get a lot of anacdotes about how L-V basically is very brutal to them, and that I would think that even though everyone in Germany would see L-V as one of the greatest men of Germany, he would have skeletons in his closet, considering how he acts against the socialists and communists.
He probably will when they do something like an uprising in Frankfurt. Would be the perfect time to get rid of them.
From the sympathetic light the German left is written though, I do think we'd get a resurgence. Maybe after L-V is dead?
I defo see the Bulgarians just sitting this one out due to German influence tho, with how intertwined Bulgaria and Germany is it'd take a serious incident to break them apart and have them go to war.
If Austria joins it'd be bc they are pressured by the Italians and the Italians only. Hell they literally get next to nothing, and I think the Austrian populace would not want to fight the war. Not that would stop dolfuss.
I think Yugoslavia would be the one who loses the most. Greece should be able to hang on, even if they lose Thessaloniki and Thrace anyways, and I see Italy heavily punished. I see the USSR going for the conquest of Finland at this point too considering how we have no mention of the winter war.
Hitler dying in the Beer Hall Putsch means that he's a virtually irrelevant political force. A large part of his rise is owed to Lüdendorff bailing out and saying he was not the leader of the Putsch (which he was, due to seniority), which allowed Hitler to take the stage.
Yeah, that's kinda the issue. Paul's going too far to the right, and too fast. Sooner or later, he's gonna catch serious pushback.
Sure. But it's also the case that these are much more fringe to the German political elite. Especially as here there would be no qualms in organizing a strike together with the communists, as there actually already wasn't IRL. Honestly, the NSFB will do something soon which will earn itself a right propper crackdown I feel. That stuff in Frankfurt would be a good time for them to try something very stupid
Austria is definitely an area where there is a lot of instability, which in turn only adds to the idea that an Austrian state on its own is inherently non-viable.
And yes, the way he treats the Left will tarnish his legacy in the future.
I do imagine the generations of the 50's and later pushing for greater liberalisation. The sympathetic light is also a little bit of author bias, as despite writing an old-fashioned monarchist Conservative, my own political feelings are not reflective of it. Plus, in general, I see all the major political parties in this as being sympathetic and righteous in their own ways. Speaking from a realistic sense, the SPD toppling his government and solidfying the Republic would be the best long-term for the people of Germany. What von Lettow-Vorbeck does will make Germany great, but not necessarily good, and it will certainly, as stated, have a lot of skeletons in the closer.
Bulgaria is currently trying to play both sides for maximum gains. As Tsar Boris mentions, the Bulgarians have been burned by unbacked guarentees before---look at the Balkan Wars--so he will need far more concrete gains to consider throwing his weight behind someone. He is generally more pro-German, but he feels that Italy can get him some results more easily. Either way, though, he certainly won't be joining any wars without it being a near-guarentee of victory.
The NSFB will also come up soon enough, they haven't had much reason to really push but the coming shift in the geopolitical stage following the Italian Invasion of Ethiopia will bring up grievances and opportunities.
Hope that it further leads to the support of austria and hungary once more under the habsburgs