A Son For Mary I of England: A timeline from 1555
- Thread starter pipisme
- Start date
I think I won this round..... 😁😁
You should probably change the name in the first thread.... its still charles there
Last edited:
I'm keeping at as Charles because otherwise subsequent posts won't make sense.
I think Philip and Charles would be the main names of the English Branch of the Habsburgs (They are not very English, but Ferdinand was not very used in germany and the German Habsburgs used a lot of ), It also would be interesting for a Habsburg to revive Richard's name (I know it was tarnished by Richard III but it is the name of a great Catholic crusader king).
Last edited:
I can't really imagine firstborn son of rulling monarch beign named Philip, after all, english kings had a long history of fighting with french kings with that name.
Of course, Charles means exactly the same problem (OTL, England having kings with that name was pretty much a coincidence).
Perhaps John would have been acceptable? It's a very popular name, used in both England and Spain, and "royal" enough.
Of course, Charles means exactly the same problem (OTL, England having kings with that name was pretty much a coincidence).
Perhaps John would have been acceptable? It's a very popular name, used in both England and Spain, and "royal" enough.
If the child was born on May 2nd, he could be name Athanasius for the Saint whose feast falls on that day. If the birth is delayed by a day, May 3rd is the Feast of St. Philip and James the Apostles, so the chances of the boy being names Philip go up exponentially.
Mary I, Princess Catherine, Edmund I
Mary I's religious policy was the same as in OTL. She revived the heresy laws which resulted in about three hundred Protestants being burnt at the stake, most notably Thomas Cranmer, John Hooper, Hugh Latimer and Nicholas Ridley.
She gave birth to a baby girl on 21 December 1557. She and Philip II named their daughter Catherine, after her mother.
Mary allied England allied with Spain in Philip's war against France, and Calais was lost to the French. She died on 17 November 1558 (as in OTL). Her son, Prince Edmund, now became King of England and Ireland as Edmund I. He was three and a half years old.
She has a mixed reputation. She is remembered as Bloody Mary, for her unpopular marriage to Philip II and for the loss of Calais to France. But also for her strong love for her two children. With the accession of Edmund, the Tudor dynasty was secure for many years to come.
She gave birth to a baby girl on 21 December 1557. She and Philip II named their daughter Catherine, after her mother.
Mary allied England allied with Spain in Philip's war against France, and Calais was lost to the French. She died on 17 November 1558 (as in OTL). Her son, Prince Edmund, now became King of England and Ireland as Edmund I. He was three and a half years old.
She has a mixed reputation. She is remembered as Bloody Mary, for her unpopular marriage to Philip II and for the loss of Calais to France. But also for her strong love for her two children. With the accession of Edmund, the Tudor dynasty was secure for many years to come.
Edmund 1, Regency Council
Philip II of Spain was the nominal head of the Regency Council for Edmund 1, but because he was in Spain the other members, who were also Privy Councillors, acted in his absence. They were:
Chancellor of the Exchequer: Sir John Baker
Secretaries of State: John Bourne and John Boxall
Lord Steward: Henry Fitzalan, 12th Earl of Arundel
Master of the Horse: Sir Henry Jerningham
Lord Chancellor: Nicholas Heath. He was also Archbishop of York.
Lord Privy Seal: Lord William Paget
Lord High Treasurer: William Paulet, 1st Marquess of Winchester
Chancellor of the Duchy of Chancellor: Sir Edward Waldegrave
Sir Henry Bedingfield who was a member of the Privy Council.
Chancellor of the Exchequer: Sir John Baker
Secretaries of State: John Bourne and John Boxall
Lord Steward: Henry Fitzalan, 12th Earl of Arundel
Master of the Horse: Sir Henry Jerningham
Lord Chancellor: Nicholas Heath. He was also Archbishop of York.
Lord Privy Seal: Lord William Paget
Lord High Treasurer: William Paulet, 1st Marquess of Winchester
Chancellor of the Duchy of Chancellor: Sir Edward Waldegrave
Sir Henry Bedingfield who was a member of the Privy Council.
Last edited:
You mean the Habsburg dynasty is secured? The Tutors are dead, long live the Big Chins!
I don't know if the children of Mary I and Philip II were Tudors or Hapsburgs.
Some of Mary's Privy Councillors had also served under Henry VIII and/or Edward VI. John Baker; Henry Fitzalan, Earl of Arundel; Lord Willi am Paget, William Paulet, Marquess of Winchester, all served under Henry and Edward, and Sir Henry Bedingfield under Edward. They all changed their religious allegiance from Catholic to Protestant and back to Catholic. Baker was a 'brutal persecutor of Protestants.' (1) He died on 23 December 1558. His office as Chancellor of the Exchequer was taken by Sir Edward Waldegrave, promoted from Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster.
Cardinal Richard Pole, Archbishop of Canterbury, died on 17th November 1558, a few hours after Queen Mary. He was succeeded by Nicholas Heath, Archbishop of York. No Protestants had been burnt at the stake in his diocese.
Edmund I's Privy Council was moderate as regards religion. The heresy laws were not enforced and no Protestants were executed for their faith. They were allowed to worship, though not in churches, where only Catholic worship was permitted.
The Marquess of Winchester, the Lord High Treasurer, was the de facto head of the Regency Council and the Privy Council. (2) He was in effect the King's Chief Minister.
(1) See his entry in Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Baker_(died_1558).
(2) Here is his entry in Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Paulet,_1st_Marquess_of_Winchester.
The closest English relation to Edmund I and Princess Catherine was their half aunt Princess Elizabeth. She returned to court from Hatfield House and helped in child care for Edmund and Catherine. Also descended from Henry VII and Elizabeth of York were Mary, Queen of Scots; Margaret Douglas, Countess of Lennox; and her son Henry Stuart, Lord Darnley. Mary was married to Francois, Dauphin of France, and living in that country. She renounced her claim to the thrones of England and Ireland on 1 December 1558. Mary of Guise was Regent in Scotland for her daughter, Mary.
John Knox returned to Scotland on 2 May 1559. On 10 May, Protestant Scottish nobles banded together as the Lords of the Congregation. Protestantism was growing in Scotland. Mobs ransacked Catholic churches and smashed images. In Perth, monks were hounded from their monasteries. The ancient sacred palace of Scone was looted and burned.
Henri II of France died on 10 June 1559 after being seriously injured in a jousting tournament. Francois II was now King of France, and Mary was Queen. The Lords of the Congregation rebelled against the growing number of French in Scotland, who had taken the best paid positions and lived an extravagant life style. Mary of Guise retreated to Dunbar to await reinforcements from France, and was there when she heard that her daughter was now Queen of France. Protestant reformers, the Huguenots, were growing in strength in France, and with internal conflict French energies were focused on France, not Scotland.
On 21 October 1559, Knox and the Lords of the Congregation declared that Mary of Guise was deposed as Regent because she allowed the French to fortify the port of Leith. James Hamilton, third Earl of Moray, declared himself Regent. In November 1559. the English Privy Council decided to stay neutral as regards the war in Scotland, and not send an army to help the rebel lords. In OTL, Elizabeth I agreed in December 1559 to send military aid to the rebel lords. By the Treaty of Berwick, signed on 27 February 1560, Elizabeth agreed with the Scottish lords to send an army to Scotland.
John Knox returned to Scotland on 2 May 1559. On 10 May, Protestant Scottish nobles banded together as the Lords of the Congregation. Protestantism was growing in Scotland. Mobs ransacked Catholic churches and smashed images. In Perth, monks were hounded from their monasteries. The ancient sacred palace of Scone was looted and burned.
Henri II of France died on 10 June 1559 after being seriously injured in a jousting tournament. Francois II was now King of France, and Mary was Queen. The Lords of the Congregation rebelled against the growing number of French in Scotland, who had taken the best paid positions and lived an extravagant life style. Mary of Guise retreated to Dunbar to await reinforcements from France, and was there when she heard that her daughter was now Queen of France. Protestant reformers, the Huguenots, were growing in strength in France, and with internal conflict French energies were focused on France, not Scotland.
On 21 October 1559, Knox and the Lords of the Congregation declared that Mary of Guise was deposed as Regent because she allowed the French to fortify the port of Leith. James Hamilton, third Earl of Moray, declared himself Regent. In November 1559. the English Privy Council decided to stay neutral as regards the war in Scotland, and not send an army to help the rebel lords. In OTL, Elizabeth I agreed in December 1559 to send military aid to the rebel lords. By the Treaty of Berwick, signed on 27 February 1560, Elizabeth agreed with the Scottish lords to send an army to Scotland.