All of Manuel I of Portugal's children are Daughters

Nova_Philomena

Manuel the Fortunate (Or the Unfortunate in this case) had numerous sons in OTL including Miguel de Paz, John III of Portugal, Luis, Duke of Beja and so on. He had about three surviving daughters, (Isabel, Beatriz and Maria).

But what if all of his children were daughters? How would that look? Who would they marry? He'd have fewer opportunities to make alliances with Austria, but at least he wouldn't exactly 'steal' Eleanor of Austria from John, Prince of Portugal. Assuming he doesn't get an annulment from Maria of Aragon after her numerous failures of producing a son, Manuel would be stuck with 10 daughters (Assuming they all survive), and another one daughter from Eleanor.

From his first marriage to Isabel of Aragon, he had a short-lived son named Miguel de Paz whom Manuel (And the Catholic Monarchs) hoped would reunite most of the Iberian Peninsula, but that short-lived dream would not exist ITL as Juana of Castile would become heiress earlier. Female!John might marry Charles V or Ferdinand (If he gets Spain ITL).

How else would it effect Portugal, let me know.
 
Tudorfan

Tudorfan

Nova_Philomena said:
Manuel the Fortunate (Or the Unfortunate in this case) had numerous sons in OTL including Miguel de Paz, John III of Portugal, Luis, Duke of Beja and so on. He had about three surviving daughters, (Isabel, Beatriz and Maria).

But what if all of his children were daughters? How would that look? Who would they marry? He'd have fewer opportunities to make alliances with Austria, but at least he wouldn't exactly 'steal' Eleanor of Austria from John, Prince of Portugal. Assuming he doesn't get an annulment from Maria of Aragon after her numerous failures of producing a son, Manuel would be stuck with 10 daughters (Assuming they all survive), and another one daughter from Eleanor.

From his first marriage to Isabel of Aragon, he had a short-lived son named Miguel de Paz whom Manuel (And the Catholic Monarchs) hoped would reunite most of the Iberian Peninsula, but that short-lived dream would not exist ITL as Juana of Castile would become heiress earlier. Female!John might marry Charles V or Ferdinand (If he gets Spain ITL).

How else would it effect Portugal, let me know.
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Well, the daughters would probably be married off to the other claimant branches - Braganza, etc - to tie everything up and make their kids successions easier in the future.
With daughters having to make marriages, there's no way Maria, Duchess of Viseu, is staying unmarried. She has to breed, like the rest of her sisters, and make the babies to avoid a massive succession crisis when Manuel kicks it.
 

Nova_Philomena

Tudorfan said:
Well, the daughters would probably be married off to the other claimant branches - Braganza, etc - to tie everything up and make their kids successions easier in the future.
With daughters having to make marriages, there's no way Maria, Duchess of Viseu, is staying unmarried. She has to breed, like the rest of her sisters, and make the babies to avoid a massive succession crisis when Manuel kicks it.
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Perhaps the Dauphin of France for Maria?

I'm not sure if the Braganza's would work, they are wealthy, but I cant see it, though it is possible because he eldest and youngest daughters will probably take up the good matches.
 
Tudorfan

Tudorfan

Nova_Philomena said:
Perhaps the Dauphin of France for Maria?

I'm not sure if the Braganza's would work, they are wealthy, but I cant see it, though it is possible because he eldest and youngest daughters will probably take up the good matches.
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It doesn't have to be Braganza. I just picked him to identify the kind of people I meant - he is a claimant to the throne, after all.

As for Maria, yes, that could work...
One could go to England if Henry divorces in 1533 still?
 
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isabella

Nova_Philomena said:
Manuel the Fortunate (Or the Unfortunate in this case) had numerous sons in OTL including Miguel de Paz, John III of Portugal, Luis, Duke of Beja and so on. He had about three surviving daughters, (Isabel, Beatriz and Maria).

But what if all of his children were daughters? How would that look? Who would they marry? He'd have fewer opportunities to make alliances with Austria, but at least he wouldn't exactly 'steal' Eleanor of Austria from John, Prince of Portugal. Assuming he doesn't get an annulment from Maria of Aragon after her numerous failures of producing a son, Manuel would be stuck with 10 daughters (Assuming they all survive), and another one daughter from Eleanor.

From his first marriage to Isabel of Aragon, he had a short-lived son named Miguel de Paz whom Manuel (And the Catholic Monarchs) hoped would reunite most of the Iberian Peninsula, but that short-lived dream would not exist ITL as Juana of Castile would become heiress earlier. Female!John might marry Charles V or Ferdinand (If he gets Spain ITL).

How else would it effect Portugal, let me know.
Click to expand...
If Isabella of Aragon birthed another Isabella instead of Miguel da Paz that little girl would still be heiress of Castile and Aragon ahead of Juana. But that would most likely mean an earlier marriage between Manuel and Maria, who could likely totally change her pregnancy pattern.

Tudorfan said:
Well, the daughters would probably be married off to the other claimant branches - Braganza, etc - to tie everything up and make their kids successions easier in the future.
With daughters having to make marriages, there's no way Maria, Duchess of Viseu, is staying unmarried. She has to breed, like the rest of her sisters, and make the babies to avoid a massive succession crisis when Manuel kicks it.
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Maria was a newborn at her father’s death and her marriage here would be far less likely than OTL as she has 10 elder sisters and some of them had without doubt already joined the church (that if Maria was born at all as I doubt who Eleanor would still be available for Manuel in this scenario as she is far likelier to end married to Sigismund I of Poland here)

Nova_Philomena said:
If Fem!Miguel de Paz still dies, would Charles or Ferdinand marry Female!John III of Portugal?
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Yes. And considering Charles’ character he could be interested in marrying such heiress (and in this way would secure his inheritance in Castile and Aragon), but we could see also Ferdinand II of Aragon securing the hand of Beatrice/Eleanor for Ferdinand of Austria (as that marriage would likely push Castile to accept Ferdinand jr as heir instead of his elder brother)
 
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Aichi72

isabella said:
If Isabella of Aragon birthed another Isabella instead of Miguel da Paz that little girl would still be heiress of Castile and Aragon ahead of Juana. But that would most likely mean an earlier marriage between Manuel and Maria, who could likely totally change her pregnancy pattern.
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Idea: fem!Miguel lives, marries Francis I of France, then their son just needs to secure the Imperial Crown and you have restored WRE.
 

isabella

Aichi72 said:
Idea: fem!Miguel lives, marries Francis I of France, then their son just needs to secure the Imperial Crown and you have restored WRE.
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That would NEVER EVER happen. Plus female Miguel would need to marry Alfonso of Ampurias for securing the Crown of Aragon
 

Nova_Philomena

isabella said:
That would NEVER EVER happen. Plus female Miguel would need to marry Alfonso of Ampurias for securing the Crown of Aragon
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fem!Miguel would probably end up with Karl V to be honest (if he gets Castile, if not, than Fernando), though Afonso is interesting as well.
 
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isabella

Nova_Philomena said:
fem!Miguel would probably end up with Karl V to be honest (if he gets Castile, if not, than Fernando).
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No, as Joanna would never be heiress of either Aragon or Castile as her niece Isabella (as that would be the name of female Miguel) is ahead of her in the line of succession. Alfonso of Ampurias instead is the Trastamara male heir and Aragon was notoriously reluctant to accept direct female succession
 

Nova_Philomena

isabella said:
No, as Joanna would never be heiress of either Aragon or Castile as her niece Isabella (as that would be the name of female Miguel) is ahead of her in the line of succession. Alfonso of Ampurias instead is the Trastamara male heir and Aragon was notoriously reluctant to accept direct female succession
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Possible match between Afonso of Ampurias and ITL Isabel, Princess of Portugal?
 

isabella

Manuel I, King of Portugal (1469-1521) married a) Isabella of Aragon and Castile (1470-1498) in 1497 b) Maria of Aragon (1482-1517) in 1500, c) ?
  1. a) Miguel da Paz, Prince of Portugal, Asturias and Girona (1498-1500)
  2. b) Isabella, Queen of Portugal ? (b. 1502)
  3. b) Beatrice (b. 1503)
  4. b) Maria (b. 1504)
  5. b) Eleanor (b. 1506)
  6. b) Margaret (b. 1508)
  7. b) Catherine (b. 1509)
  8. b) Joanna (b. 1512)
  9. b) Manuela (1513)
  10. b) Anna (b. 1515)
  11. b) Philippa (1516)

notes
Maybe Julia of Aragon-Naples could be a possible third wife for Manuel as Eleanor of Austria here will likely be married to Sigismund I of Poland
 

Nova_Philomena

isabella said:
Manuel I, King of Portugal (1469-1521) married a) Isabella of Aragon and Castile (1470-1498) in 1497 b) Maria of Aragon (1482-1517) in 1500, c) ?
  1. a) Miguel da Paz, Prince of Portugal, Asturias and Girona (1498-1500)
  2. b) Isabella, Queen of Portugal ? (b. 1502)
  3. b) Beatrice (b. 1503)
  4. b) Maria (b. 1504)
  5. b) Eleanor (b. 1506)
  6. b) Margaret (b. 1508)
  7. b) Catherine (b. 1509)
  8. b) Joanna (b. 1512)
  9. b) Manuela (1513)
  10. b) Anna (b. 1515)
  11. b) Philippa (1516)

notes
Maybe Julia of Aragon-Naples could be a possible third wife for Manuel as Eleanor of Austria here will likely be married to Sigismund I of Poland
Click to expand...
Daughter of Isabel de Balzo?
 

rain_in_may

isabella said:
Manuel I, King of Portugal (1469-1521) married a) Isabella of Aragon and Castile (1470-1498) in 1497 b) Maria of Aragon (1482-1517) in 1500, c) ?
  1. a) Miguel da Paz, Prince of Portugal, Asturias and Girona (1498-1500)
  2. b) Isabella, Queen of Portugal ? (b. 1502)
  3. b) Beatrice (b. 1503)
  4. b) Maria (b. 1504)
  5. b) Eleanor (b. 1506)
  6. b) Margaret (b. 1508)
  7. b) Catherine (b. 1509)
  8. b) Joanna (b. 1512)
  9. b) Manuela (1513)
  10. b) Anna (b. 1515)
  11. b) Philippa (1516)

notes
Maybe Julia of Aragon-Naples could be a possible third wife for Manuel as Eleanor of Austria here will likely be married to Sigismund I of Poland
Click to expand...
Few of them will become nuns.
 
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