Yes, they do. And their relationships vary from place to place. In the Templar State of Black Sarah, it is generally the worst as they are forced to adopt Romani customs, leading to large-scale Hungarian migrations to Germany. Also in the Ghorbati Khanate Ghorbats are a ruling minority separated by Caste from Turkic Soldiers and Iranian subjects. Abdals and Romanipen State is however far more egalitarian.
Map Thread XXI
- Thread starter fluttersky
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Are the Romani Still Hindu?Or did they convert to Islam/Christianity like OTL?
What's the religion(s) of the Romani? Do they share one religion, like Islam or their folk beliefs, from the Ghorbati to the Black Sabah, or are they split between many religions?
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hehehe
Abdals are Bekhtashis with Romani folkloric substratum while European Romani states have their own independent Church which also has a Romani substratum thus the States dedicated to Romani Saints like the Black Sarah. Ghorbatis are still kinda Hindu in the same way Qalashas and Nuristanis are Hindu.
Ah fascinating. Obviously in Black Sarah the Romani force the locals to assimilate into their culture but in places like Persia and the Romanipen State, to what degree do the Roma take on elements of local cultures (after all Persia is great at assimilating foreign dynasties and the Romanipen State as you said is pretty nice to the locals.
As you said Persia is really good at assimilating the conquerors into locals. Ghorbatis are Iranized too except for Religion and Language. They have more in common with central Iranian and Eastern Persians like Tajiks and Dari Speakers than Farsi speakers, however.
Romanipen State is also pretty tolerant too but there is still a distinct cultural difference between the Folkoristic Romani and the Orthodox Bulgarians, Serbs, and Greeks. This has more to do with Romani traditionally not intermarrying with the non-Romani peoples than anything.
Part of my timeline where Italy goes neutral and tries its damnedest to keep East Africa.
- In the 60s they split up East Africa back into its constituent governates, Eritrea and Somalia become "dominions"
- They fight an Afghanistan-style war to keep it but eventually give up in 1981 -- Ethiopia is abandoned
- The communists win in the south, turning Scio and Galla-Sidamo into a communist "Ethiopia" claiming all of the pre-war state
- Amara becomes a christian nationalist state, claiming to be the "true successor" to Ethiopia. They limit their claims to the former Scio governate, claiming it as ethnic Amhara land
- Harrar is a weak democracy dominated by a shaky coalition between its Harari and Somali residents.
- Eritrea is a settler state with an Italian majority. Since the restoration of democracy, they have made progress towards minority rights, but it is questionable whether they will actually bring equality.
- Somalia has an Italian
plurality overallminority, concentrated on the coast around Mogadishu. The state is based on the idea of Somali nationalism with Italian characteristics. With the Ethiopian Civil War, they have occupied part of Ethiopia under the claim of peacekeeping. Their claims on Kenya are assumed to be posturing. - Ethiopia is going through a civil war against the perceived hegemony of the Amhara elite, and the continued push for "reuniting Ethiopia" long after most abandoned the idea. It is mainly being fought by Oromo separatists.
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How many Italians would have to be moved in to make Eritrea and Somali majority/plurality Italian?
A lot. The peak was 10 or so percent Italian, but I figured if Italy really went in on it, they could get it done. There's also assimilation to consider, but I haven't planned this all out.
You do not need to remove countries that are unchanged from OTL.
A Sequel of Sorts to my previous Linguistic map depicting an Alternate Turkic Language Family. This one depicts all the languages in Middle East Adjacent Regions. You might have noticed a lot of Oddities such as Turkic languages in Egypt and Hejaz. and the Chinese in Arabia. Turkic language in Egypt was because of the Mongol victory in Ain Jalut which saw being considered Turks to become much more advantageous than being considered Arabs. ıt also lead to the expansion of Tedda-speaking Nomads thanks to the Mongol's patronage of nomads as long as they fought in their armies.
As for the elephant in the Room, There was a Zheng He-like figure who sailed there and founded a port colony in Yemen called Chentu. This colony grew and grew after Ming loyalists fled the Qing incursion there. Although the majority converted to Islam, the Chinese brought Confucianism and Buddhism there(which still survive as a distinguished minority in Yemen) and did not ditch them entirely which changed the interpretation of Islam extremely so and caused a new schism. leading to Gedimu Sect to be born(Chinese name for Qadiris) This new heresy was not received well by Arabs who saw it as an invasion of not only their land but also their Religion. This led to a new fitna period that saw the Chinese be Victorious and gain political power over almost all of the Arabian Peninsula and the Horn of Africa. Chinese were not kind to the Arabic language and banned it much like how Arabs had banned Persian in Iran and had cut the tongues of everyone who publicly spoke it and called them ajams as an insult. Chinese did the same which saw other Semitic languages that were on the verge of dying to become much more prominent in Southern Arabia.
I guess i should say that the inspiration came from a shitpost titled “Muslim Alabama: The Caliphate of Al-Abama”
This map was the result of a series of continent-wide anthropological studies of the nomadic and tribal cultures of North America in the 3100s by the University of Tharsis. Although it found substantial linguistic divergence across the subcontinent, in all, the findings added support to the still-controversial 'proto-Atlantean' hypothesis, which connects hundreds of languages worldwide to a single origin language thought to have originated either in the Caribbean or in western Europe.
It also marked an important step in reconstructing the proto-Amero-English language, accepted to be the common ancestor of many North American languages as well as some British. Across the continent, although the primary word used to describe a certain concept differed, cognates with somewhat shifted meanings were extremely common, hinting at a common ancestor. For example, the word 'siti', meaning 'large settlement' in many northeastern languages, has a cognate in 'chusa' in the Cascadian region, where it means 'realm' or 'kingdom.'
Some outlier languages, particularly in the Great Plains and the Appalachians, continue to stump researchers looking for links to their neighbors. Some leading scholars see these languages as the last survivors of a pre-proto-Atlantean substrate, and have begun to try to reconstruct these languages through studies of placenames.
A post-apocalyptic etymology map - I was inspired by /u/ladyegg's recent reddit post and just had to try making my own. Credit also to the University of Amsterdam-Leiden for their very cool maps, which this template was based on. Obviously this doesn't make much sense in English; assume that the non-italicized words are in the OOC language.
I unfortunately have no linguistic training and am not sure whether the sound & semantic shifts I chose are reasonable. If anyone knows more about this subject I would love to hear about it, now that I have this template I am thinking about making some more in this series and would be interested to hear about ways to make this more plausible for other words! Possibly on the drawing board - 'king' and 'money'.
It also marked an important step in reconstructing the proto-Amero-English language, accepted to be the common ancestor of many North American languages as well as some British. Across the continent, although the primary word used to describe a certain concept differed, cognates with somewhat shifted meanings were extremely common, hinting at a common ancestor. For example, the word 'siti', meaning 'large settlement' in many northeastern languages, has a cognate in 'chusa' in the Cascadian region, where it means 'realm' or 'kingdom.'
Some outlier languages, particularly in the Great Plains and the Appalachians, continue to stump researchers looking for links to their neighbors. Some leading scholars see these languages as the last survivors of a pre-proto-Atlantean substrate, and have begun to try to reconstruct these languages through studies of placenames.
A post-apocalyptic etymology map - I was inspired by /u/ladyegg's recent reddit post and just had to try making my own. Credit also to the University of Amsterdam-Leiden for their very cool maps, which this template was based on. Obviously this doesn't make much sense in English; assume that the non-italicized words are in the OOC language.
I unfortunately have no linguistic training and am not sure whether the sound & semantic shifts I chose are reasonable. If anyone knows more about this subject I would love to hear about it, now that I have this template I am thinking about making some more in this series and would be interested to hear about ways to make this more plausible for other words! Possibly on the drawing board - 'king' and 'money'.
Beatriz
Gone Fishin'
I like the “war gains” shading for conflicts, like in @B_Munro ‘s Soy La Libertad
Map Thread VI
I rather like the idea of an Island off the coast of England... like an anti-Eire... Implementation time!!
www.alternatehistory.com
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Incredibly good map. I love it. Please also make one for South America or the Old World.This map was the result of a series of continent-wide anthropological studies of the nomadic and tribal cultures of North America in the 3100s by the University of Tharsis. Although it found substantial linguistic divergence across the subcontinent, in all, the findings added support to the still-controversial 'proto-Atlantean' hypothesis, which connects hundreds of languages worldwide to a single origin language thought to have originated either in the Caribbean or in western Europe.
It also marked an important step in reconstructing the proto-Amero-English language, accepted to be the common ancestor of many North American languages as well as some British. Across the continent, although the primary word used to describe a certain concept differed, cognates with somewhat shifted meanings were extremely common, hinting at a common ancestor. For example, the word 'siti', meaning 'large settlement' in many northeastern languages, has a cognate in 'chusa' in the Cascadian region, where it means 'realm' or 'kingdom.'
Some outlier languages, particularly in the Great Plains and the Appalachians, continue to stump researchers looking for links to their neighbors. Some leading scholars see these languages as the last survivors of a pre-proto-Atlantean substrate, and have begun to try to reconstruct these languages through studies of placenames.
A post-apocalyptic etymology map - I was inspired by /u/ladyegg's recent reddit post and just had to try making my own. Credit also to the University of Amsterdam-Leiden for their very cool maps, which this template was based on. Obviously this doesn't make much sense in English; assume that the non-italicized words are in the OOC language.
I unfortunately have no linguistic training and am not sure whether the sound & semantic shifts I chose are reasonable. If anyone knows more about this subject I would love to hear about it, now that I have this template I am thinking about making some more in this series and would be interested to hear about ways to make this more plausible for other words! Possibly on the drawing board - 'king' and 'money'.
This map was the result of a series of continent-wide anthropological studies of the nomadic and tribal cultures of North America in the 3100s by the University of Tharsis. Although it found substantial linguistic divergence across the subcontinent, in all, the findings added support to the still-controversial 'proto-Atlantean' hypothesis, which connects hundreds of languages worldwide to a single origin language thought to have originated either in the Caribbean or in western Europe.
It also marked an important step in reconstructing the proto-Amero-English language, accepted to be the common ancestor of many North American languages as well as some British. Across the continent, although the primary word used to describe a certain concept differed, cognates with somewhat shifted meanings were extremely common, hinting at a common ancestor. For example, the word 'siti', meaning 'large settlement' in many northeastern languages, has a cognate in 'chusa' in the Cascadian region, where it means 'realm' or 'kingdom.'
Some outlier languages, particularly in the Great Plains and the Appalachians, continue to stump researchers looking for links to their neighbors. Some leading scholars see these languages as the last survivors of a pre-proto-Atlantean substrate, and have begun to try to reconstruct these languages through studies of placenames.
A post-apocalyptic etymology map - I was inspired by /u/ladyegg's recent reddit post and just had to try making my own. Credit also to the University of Amsterdam-Leiden for their very cool maps, which this template was based on. Obviously this doesn't make much sense in English; assume that the non-italicized words are in the OOC language.
I unfortunately have no linguistic training and am not sure whether the sound & semantic shifts I chose are reasonable. If anyone knows more about this subject I would love to hear about it, now that I have this template I am thinking about making some more in this series and would be interested to hear about ways to make this more plausible for other words! Possibly on the drawing board - 'king' and 'money'.
Really cool stuff!
Those work good when the border isn't too fickle but rather smooth, otherwise you get single line patterns in bulges
Splendid work. It’s a simple map but that clean look suits it well.Part of my timeline where Italy goes neutral and tries its damnedest to keep East Africa.
- In the 60s they split up East Africa back into its constituent governates, Eritrea and Somalia become "dominions"
- They fight an Afghanistan-style war to keep it but eventually give up in 1981 -- Ethiopia is abandoned
- The communists win in the south, turning Scio and Galla-Sidamo into a communist "Ethiopia" claiming all of the pre-war state
- Amara becomes a christian nationalist state, claiming to be the "true successor" to Ethiopia. They limit their claims to the former Scio governate, claiming it as ethnic Amhara land
- Harrar is a weak democracy dominated by a shaky coalition between its Harari and Somali residents.
- Eritrea is a settler state with an Italian majority. Since the restoration of democracy, they have made progress towards minority rights, but it is questionable whether they will actually bring equality.
- Somalia has an Italian plurality overall, but the Italian population is concentrated on the coast around Mogadishu. The state is based on the idea of Somali nationalism with Italian characteristics. With the Ethiopian Civil War, they have occupied part of Ethiopia under the claim of peacekeeping. Their claims on Kenya are assumed to be posturing.
- Ethiopia is going through a civil war against the perceived hegemony of the Amhara elite, and the continued push for "reuniting Ethiopia" long after most abandoned the idea. It is mainly being fought by Oromo separatists.
Detailed and thought oht lore too.
VIII mentions Lithuania, but is positioned at Egypt. Move to Lithuania?
X is redundant info that you don't normally do since it's already in the map's legend: "Mwenemutapa (British empire client state)"
I mention this in case you wanted to modify the VIII for whatever Egypt thing you had in mind... canal related?
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