With all the different missiles in different countries pointed at the USSR and the near obsolsecence it; it was a test.
Nixon was considered a known quanity and Kennedy considered weak after Pay of Pigs and Vienna. Why not try Cuba.
Was John F. Kennedy the flat-out absolute worst president of the 20th century?
- Thread starter Lyly
- Start date
With all the different missiles in different countries pointed at the USSR and the near obsolsecence it; it was a test.
Nixon was considered a known quanity and Kennedy considered weak after Pay of Pigs and Vienna. Why not try Cuba.
Any other missiles that close to the USSR? And with nuclear weapons, obsolescence is relative.
That sounds like a threat the same way Cuba sounds like a threat.
I'm not saying it being a test had absolutely nothing to do with it, but it makes sense with or without wanting to test him (Kennedy).
My top five worst: Harding, Carter, Hoover, Ford, Wilson. Now, clearly the deciding factor is whether you have an 'r' in your name. (Wilson is a fluke.) Kennedy does not have an 'r', and therefore cannot be the worst president of the 20th century. 
My top five worst: Harding, Carter, Hoover, Ford, Wilson. Now, clearly the deciding factor is whether you have an 'r' in your name. (Wilson is a fluke.) Kennedy does not have an 'r', and therefore cannot be the worst president of the 20th century.
FitzgeRald.
FitzgeRald.
You want to know what's even more terrifying? Only two Presidents in the 20th century did not have 'r's in their names. And one of them was Johnson.
And...yes! I have an 'r' in my middle name! I can be President! Is this a great country or what?
That has to be the most amusing reason I've heard to vote for a president since I saw the Vote Cthulhu posters.
Does Cthulhu count as not having an R in his name, since his real name is probably even less pronounceable than Cthulhu?
That has to be the most amusing reason I've heard to vote for a president since I saw the Vote Cthulhu posters.
Does Cthulhu count as not having an R in his name, since his real name is probably even less pronounceable than Cthulhu?
Well, he is Cthulhu van R'lyeh. So, you know.
Keenir
Banned
My top five worst: Harding, Carter, Hoover, Ford, Wilson. Now, clearly the deciding factor is whether you have an 'r' in your name. (Wilson is a fluke.) Kennedy does not have an 'r', and therefore cannot be the worst president of the 20th century.
depends how you're pronouncing it.
Whew.
Now I'm torn on who to vote for though.
Vote Vader. He has two 'R's. Three, if you write it Anakin Skywalker, Darth Vader.
Vader 2012: The Circle is Now Complete
My middle name starts with an 'R' and shared with a certain 20th century Presidential candidate.......(Hint: it wasn't Ronald Reagan)
2 Presidents? Who are you missing: William McKinley, (John) Calvin Coolidge, or Lyndon Baines Johnson?
Roosevelt, Richard, or Rudolph.
Oh wait. Candidate. So that would also include: Robert (Robert Marion La Follette and Robert Joseph Dole) and Ross (Henry Ross Perot). I hope CaliBoy's parents didn't name him after Ross Perot. That'd be kinda sad.
20th Century Presidents by number of Rs:
4
- Herbert Clark Hoover (1929-1933)
- George Herbert Walker Bush (1989-1993)
3
- Warren Gamaliel Harding (1921-1923)
- Harry S. Truman (1945-1953)
- Gerald Rudolph Ford (1974-1977)
- James Earl Carter (1977-1981)
2
- Theodore Roosevelt (1901-1909)
- Franklin Delano Roosevelt (1933-1945)
- Richard Milhous Nixon (1969-1974)
- Ronald Wilson Reagan (1981-1989)
1
- William Howard Taft (1909-1913)
- (Thomas) Woodrow Wilson (1913-1921)
- Dwight David Eisenhower (1953-1961)
- John Fitzgerald Kennedy (1961-1963)
- William Jefferson Clinton (1993-2001)
0
- William McKinley (1897-1901)
- (John) Calvin Coolidge (1923-1929)
- Lyndon Baines Johnson (1963-1969)
Technically, it was William McKinley, Jr. And I suppose Calvin Coolidge, Jr. too. So only Lyndon Johnson doesn't have an 'r'.
By what criteria does one judge a president to be the "Worst"?
If you lay out object criteria, then you can judge it.
If you lay out object criteria, then you can judge it.
Yeah, given the source you have to read the claim as "JFK was the worst (foreign policy) president in the 20th."
Grading 20thC US Presidents
Kennedy was indeed the worst IF he covered up the invasion of ASB!!! Otherwise, it is hard to rank JFK that low.
Students at 3 universities have tossed the Pres rankings question to me for a dozen years. Here is my take:
First, a US President CANNOT control the economic cycle by executive fiat and thus his “grade” cannot be anchored to the curves of the US economy. FDR bought more government strength into the economy than ever before. The Great Depression still got worse under his watch long before war spending and mobilization brought recovery. Presidents can have some influence, but it is folly to judge FDR a failure as President because the US economy got worse. Likewise, Clinton cannot be a success based solely because the US economy was humming [or at least pre-ENRON hundreds of companies reported great earnings that were later “revised” downward.]
Second, foreign policy must be judged in the context of national polices at the time that transcended a single President. The earlier posts on Bay of Pigs correctly argue that some actions were broadly US policy and not solely under the banner of 1 President. JFK can “lose points” for Bay of Pigs, but the whole failure is not JFK’s.
Third, ranking the Presidents is worthless if the grader’s personal politics trump the actual record. I could hate Reagan for certain policies, but to rank his 2 terms among the worst Presidencies… that would be intellectual dishonesty.
17 Presidents: six good, six passed as average, five judged and found Failures.
William McKinley (1897-1901) Nine months of 20th Century = no grade
Theodore Roosevelt (1901-1909) Good. Effective Executive who set and met goals
William Howard Taft (1909-1913) Average
Woodrow Wilson (1913-1921) Good. While his world vision was unrealized, Wilson understood when it was time for war and unlike LBJ and others let his generals execute the details.
Warren G. Harding (1921-1923) Fail. Scandals blight his limited time.
Calvin Coolidge (1923-1929) Average.
Herbert Clark Hoover (1929-1933) Fail. Do no harm needed to be in his oath.
Franklin Delano Roosevelt (1933-1945) Good. Clearly an epic American leader even if a pariah to conservatives.
Harry S Truman (1945-1953) Good. Upon Historical reflection, Truman made many great decisions in diverse areas. A good leader who used Nukes to end one war but refused to use nukes to expand another.
Dwight David Eisenhower (1953-1961) Good. He fulfilled his elected mandate to end active hostilities in Korea and wage a Cold War. Leadership and restraint in domestic spending, attention to rising civil rights struggle and used U-2 spy knowledge NOT for politics but for limiting the explosion of the arms race. Points lost for BayofP but not enough to --just-- make the cut above average.
John F Kennedy (1961-1963) Average. A mixed record. Undeniable leadership of “free” World and of a “new generation,” increased federal Civil Rights actions although some critical for failing to do more. Undeniable Poor judgements at Bay, and SE Asia. Harsh views on CubaMC ignore the leadership that helped the nukes NOT to fly. Lofty, costly moonshot goal met in part as honorific legacy post-death.
Lyndon B Johnson (1963-1969) Fail. LBJ lost at home and on the road. Passage of Civil Rights laws not enough to raise his grade above the violence on US streets & Vietnam.
Richard M Nixon (1969-1974) Fail. Limited Foreign policy success cannot overcome scandal of presidential abuse of power.
Gerald R Ford (1974-1977) Average
James E Carter (1977-1981) Fail. Economy not under his control but Carter clearly stumbled at home and abroad. Honesty not enough to raise his grade.
Ronald W Reagan (1981-1989) Average. Like Clinton below, scandal was not enough to cripple this master of the television age.
George H W Bush (1989-1993) Good. Like Truman, history is proving more kind than the initial vote out of office. Application of US Power and better exits that 21stC foreign actions. Recession not his fault any more than Truman.
William J Clinton (1993-2001) Average. Personal scandals and 2nd impeachment in US history are marks against him. Perjury by Chief Executive is never a good thing.
Kennedy was indeed the worst IF he covered up the invasion of ASB!!! Otherwise, it is hard to rank JFK that low.
Students at 3 universities have tossed the Pres rankings question to me for a dozen years. Here is my take:
First, a US President CANNOT control the economic cycle by executive fiat and thus his “grade” cannot be anchored to the curves of the US economy. FDR bought more government strength into the economy than ever before. The Great Depression still got worse under his watch long before war spending and mobilization brought recovery. Presidents can have some influence, but it is folly to judge FDR a failure as President because the US economy got worse. Likewise, Clinton cannot be a success based solely because the US economy was humming [or at least pre-ENRON hundreds of companies reported great earnings that were later “revised” downward.]
Second, foreign policy must be judged in the context of national polices at the time that transcended a single President. The earlier posts on Bay of Pigs correctly argue that some actions were broadly US policy and not solely under the banner of 1 President. JFK can “lose points” for Bay of Pigs, but the whole failure is not JFK’s.
Third, ranking the Presidents is worthless if the grader’s personal politics trump the actual record. I could hate Reagan for certain policies, but to rank his 2 terms among the worst Presidencies… that would be intellectual dishonesty.
17 Presidents: six good, six passed as average, five judged and found Failures.
William McKinley (1897-1901) Nine months of 20th Century = no grade
Theodore Roosevelt (1901-1909) Good. Effective Executive who set and met goals
William Howard Taft (1909-1913) Average
Woodrow Wilson (1913-1921) Good. While his world vision was unrealized, Wilson understood when it was time for war and unlike LBJ and others let his generals execute the details.
Warren G. Harding (1921-1923) Fail. Scandals blight his limited time.
Calvin Coolidge (1923-1929) Average.
Herbert Clark Hoover (1929-1933) Fail. Do no harm needed to be in his oath.
Franklin Delano Roosevelt (1933-1945) Good. Clearly an epic American leader even if a pariah to conservatives.
Harry S Truman (1945-1953) Good. Upon Historical reflection, Truman made many great decisions in diverse areas. A good leader who used Nukes to end one war but refused to use nukes to expand another.
Dwight David Eisenhower (1953-1961) Good. He fulfilled his elected mandate to end active hostilities in Korea and wage a Cold War. Leadership and restraint in domestic spending, attention to rising civil rights struggle and used U-2 spy knowledge NOT for politics but for limiting the explosion of the arms race. Points lost for BayofP but not enough to --just-- make the cut above average.
John F Kennedy (1961-1963) Average. A mixed record. Undeniable leadership of “free” World and of a “new generation,” increased federal Civil Rights actions although some critical for failing to do more. Undeniable Poor judgements at Bay, and SE Asia. Harsh views on CubaMC ignore the leadership that helped the nukes NOT to fly. Lofty, costly moonshot goal met in part as honorific legacy post-death.
Lyndon B Johnson (1963-1969) Fail. LBJ lost at home and on the road. Passage of Civil Rights laws not enough to raise his grade above the violence on US streets & Vietnam.
Richard M Nixon (1969-1974) Fail. Limited Foreign policy success cannot overcome scandal of presidential abuse of power.
Gerald R Ford (1974-1977) Average
James E Carter (1977-1981) Fail. Economy not under his control but Carter clearly stumbled at home and abroad. Honesty not enough to raise his grade.
Ronald W Reagan (1981-1989) Average. Like Clinton below, scandal was not enough to cripple this master of the television age.
George H W Bush (1989-1993) Good. Like Truman, history is proving more kind than the initial vote out of office. Application of US Power and better exits that 21stC foreign actions. Recession not his fault any more than Truman.
William J Clinton (1993-2001) Average. Personal scandals and 2nd impeachment in US history are marks against him. Perjury by Chief Executive is never a good thing.
He's definitely the most overrated, but he's far from the worst. Wilson, Harding, Coolidge, Hoover, LBJ, Nixon, Carter, and GWB were all clearly worse than Kennedy.
Bulletsfromthegrassyknoll
Banned
Anyone who thinks LBJ was a bad President is out of their minds. Yes, when it came to foreign policy, he failed in an epic manner, but we can only say that in retrospect. Johnson was weak, he let the Pentagon manipulate him, he had too much respect for military officials. JFK, however, was wary of the military industrial complex.
LBJ could do things JFK wasn't able do because of his background. Many distrusted JFK because his family exerted so much power. LBJ was well known among his fellow politicians and an old-timer, meaning he could manipulate Congress in his favor.
LBJ could do things JFK wasn't able do because of his background. Many distrusted JFK because his family exerted so much power. LBJ was well known among his fellow politicians and an old-timer, meaning he could manipulate Congress in his favor.